... Robert. You have raised some valid points, though, which warrant further discussion:

>> Every year hundreds upon hundreds of LE's are issued, if one were to consider
>> the amount in vaults, the few in play and those destroyed, the remainder is
>> still a phenomenal amount.

Yes, lots of LE's, though I frankly think most of them are not good candidates for slabbing as most are in new condition and the value of the chip does not warrant the cost of slabbing.

>> We as members of the club therefore represent only a tiny fraction of the
>> collectors out there considering the amount of chips assimilated into
>> collections on a yearly basis. When you factor in the amount of us that read
>> the boards its even less.

No question that there are a lot of collectors who are not club members. Nevertheless, we are the biggest (if not the only) chip collecting club there is. What we as a club say matters. If the club takes a firm stand on this, many collectors will follow us.

>> Unless we decide to spend a great deal of money and launch an ad campaign to
>> try to stop this it WILL happen. Why? GREEEEED.

I am not advocating an advertising campaign against slabbing. If we all just won't buy the damn things, not many of them will get slabbed to begin with. If we just won't buy ANYTHING from a dealer who sells slabbed chips, dealers will stop handling them.

>> We say we will neither buy nor sell slabbed chips until the day we discover
>> something that we really need to fill a hole in our collection and then...

A valid point and a real problem. Self-discipline. In 1994, major league baseball players went on strike, ruining a great season and cancelling the World Series. Though a baseball fan since 1952, I swore (along with a lot of other people) that I was through with baseball. I have not been to or even watched a game on TV since. Baseball has recovered a lot of lost fans (though they are in danger of losing them again if they strike at the end of this contract), but not me. In fact, I've passed beyond anger to apathy, which is probably makes is less likely that I will ever regain interest in baseball. Strong emotions can be turned (as mine were once), but indifference is difficult to overcome. I turned my attention (and affection) to college football. We can do the same here; just don't buy slabbed chips and look for something else.

>> We say we like to handle and hold our chips and we don't like encapsulation
>> yet we purchase limited edition sets that are already encapsulated we store
>> our collections in albums, flips, cardboard holders and lucite discs.

For the most part, we collect loose chips. Even those which are in holders can generally be removed without great difficulty. Slabbed chips are enclosed in a hermetically sealed plastic holder which can be opened only with great difficulty (and only by destroying the holder). In essence, once a chip is slabbed, it can never again be fondled! <g>

>> We don't want a grading system but in current E-bay auctions we as sellers
>> use terms such as Mint, Sharp edges, Straight from the cage, All chips mint
>> and individually sealed. Never hit the tables, No nicks, slight surface wear,
>> some gold stamping missing etc. etc. etc.
>> Are we not also being somewhat hypocritical? Do you not want to know the
>> condition of something you are buying?

As I explained in my post to Peter Sanders, there is a difference between a detailed grading system, such as would be necessary to make slabbing meaningful, and grading definitions that will help collectors decide the value of chips they are considering buying.

>> I think what we are against here is an outside organization creating a
>> grading system and profiting at our expense... I too am against this.

I am opposed to ANYONE creating a detailed grading system which will be used to artificially inflate the prices of top end material (which is where slabbing will be most likely to be used).

>> Perhaps the best offense is a good defense. Maybe we as a club should beat
>> them to the punch and establish some uniform way of determining condition.
>> This might negate the need for an outside grading system.

I do think the club should adopt uniform grading definitions. I disagree with the "slippery slope" argument that doing so will inevitably lead to more detailed grading systems "based" on the CC>CC definitions. The club can always adopt, endorse or disavow any attempt to modify its own definitions.

----- jim o\-S