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The Chip Board Archive 17

Re: I think Counterfeits is more accurate ...

It is not always easy to distinguish real from bogus.

For me, I have noticed patterns. He (Joe Winstead from Georgia), usually puts 5 or so up at the same time. Here is a search of his auctions:

http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZjb1967ss

Checking the dates, you can see that he has divided the chips into 2 groups of auctions. Also, if the bidding is low (20 to 30), stay away.

Also, carefully read his descriptions. If I was selling ivory chips, I would say genuine hand carved ivory chips, carved anywhere from 100 to 200 or more years ago. Notice that he is careful in his language, a sure red flag for me.

With respect to the chip itself:

Note in the example below (fake on top), that the ring is not centered in the fake. If the chip was hand carved, the chip would have been placed on a lathe. A knife would have then been held against the chip to produce a perfectly centered ring. Not so with the fake.

Since a genuine chip is hand carved, a line (or curve) would be smooth (as such a line is made with a continuous motion) The start of the curve would be heavy or thick (where the knife enters the ivory) and the end of the curve tapered to a fine point (where the knife leaves the ivory). Lines in the fake ivory usually have a blunt begining and a blunt end.

Note that with the fake the machine scrathes the ivory (as is done in scrimshaw). Carved ivory produces smooth lines.

Many of the fake ivories are cut wrong (although I've noticed that he has, for the most part, rectified this mistake). Using wood terms, ivory should be cross cut not ripped. Like with wood, it is easy to tell from the "grain" if you are looking at the ripped side or the cross cut(endgrain) side.

Lastly, many times the color is "off". The colored rings in antique ivory wear from the outside in or from the inside out or in an elliptical pattern. The wear pattern is based on the flatness of the ivory (or weather it is slightly warped). I've noticed that some of the fakes are worn (he really wants them to look aged!!) from the inside out AND the outside in at the same time. I've also seen the color worn in a horizontal pattern (obviously some sort of abrasive was used in a side to side manner).

Lastly, the chip usually just does not look right. I guess that come from experience.

I've captured many of his fakes and have displayed them on my website. Hoopefully prospective buyers will first check my site or, better yet, just email me!!!!!!

I haven't had tinme to put the prest batch on my site. They should be there in the next day or so.

Lastly I must say that I was very disappointed with the attitude of one of the old pro collectors on this board. He defended the making of the counterfeits as works of art. These "works of art" will ruin ivory collecting


Messages In This Thread

eBay is having a chip "Reproductions" category
eBay is having a "Non-Casino Chips" category
What would go in a chip "Non-Casino Chips" sub-cat
I WOULDN'T THINK THAT
Re: eBay is having a "Non-Casino Chips" category
I think Counterfeits is more accurate ...
I HAVE TRIED FOR SEVERAL YEARS....
Re: I HAVE TRIED FOR SEVERAL YEARS....
Re: I think Counterfeits is more accurate ...
A Counterfeit is an exact duplicate of an original
Re: I think Counterfeits is more accurate ...
Re: I think Counterfeits is more accurate ...
One more fake sign to look fo.
Re: One more fake sign to look fo.
Re: One more fake sign to look fo.
All three of those chips are drastically differen
How about this example
Rich... They should be 2 codes
If that recent creation was an original ...
Re: If that recent creation was an original ...
Re: If that recent creation was an original ...
An answer to your question:
A day late and a dollar short John?
OOPS! I mean Robert E.
That's ok... Just don't let it happen again. grin

Copyright 2022 David Spragg